Poll - Cinnamon Remix of Ubuntu?

Flavors
#1

It is about time.

Last Sunday, I wanted to know if there was a Cinnamon Remix/Flavor of Ubuntu. The answer was no, and for what there is, it is discontinued. This was all learned in my previous post here.

So, I will go from forum to forum, and through all linux communities I can find, even through Discord, is if there should be a Cinnamon Remix of Ubuntu.

This is going to be a global Ubuntu community poll. If you have a place to suggest for a poll. put in the comments.

This is good, especially since it is a good desktop for people switching from Windows to Linux, but Linux Mint also might be the player that is standing in front of us.

And without further ado, its time for the main poll:

Should I get a group of people to make a Cinnamon remix of Ubuntu?

  • Yes
  • No

0 voters

And for a name? Yes-Cubuntu means ass in Portuguese, and Cubuntu was already made but discontinued. So, Cinnabuntu, or Ubuntu Cinnamon.

EDIT: For now, we will use the name of “Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix”, in order to prevent issues from the main Ubuntu team (thanks to popey for letting me know). So, IF we get accepted (and do this) then, which will it be?

  • Cinnabuntu
  • Ubuntu Cinnamon

0 voters

Good luck.
-ItzSwirlz

#2

Please consider that for some time now the technical board have not approved of *buntu names for new flavours (which start life as remixes usually).

So you’ll need to use “Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix” or similar, as Cinnabuntu will simply be politely rejected by the technical board further down the line. Of course you could call it something which doesn’t use the Ubuntu trademark at all, as Tony George did with his “Umix” derivative, based on Unity.

This may be frustrating, but it’s important that you have the facts, and don’t name your project something that you’ll end up having to rename later.

3 Likes
#3

Thanks, I have just made an edit stating that until we get an approval we will use “Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix”. :slight_smile:

#4

Sorry to have a rather negative attitude here but: isn’t linux mint pretty similar to this idea? How about trying to convince linux mint to reach all the requirements of becoming an official ubuntu flavour? I think beside the DE it only adds some little patches like “install codec x” or something - I could be wrong though :slight_smile: Please elude me!

3 Likes
#5

I voted yes but I think I’d rather see the flurry desktop or deepin over cinnamon but I do wish you all the best with your endeavour.

#6

@itzswirlz

I haven’t voted yes or no yet for,

  1. Neither the Ubuntu repos, nor Embrosyn’s PPA has the newest Cinnamon packages, so Cinnamon Desktop you get would be old.
  2. It is easier to move newest Cinnamon 4.0 desktop from Linux Mint to disco repos, with only one unimportant Mint app working on it. Even, if you’d download and install all Tessa repo packages, that app would not work, not until, Linux Mint moves to future Ubuntu 20.04 LTS base – Mint actually considers Ubuntu repos as sort of dangerous to upgrade from, without being checked by them.

I am writing from that Disco-Cinnamon installation, fully upgraded today, using the Cinnamon-Mint upgrader app. It is still named Linux Mint 19.1 Tessa, but it can be named Disco-Cinnamon or whatever. It not anymore that Linux Mint 19.1 Tessa.

(There’s screeny on that in your earlier post.)

Now, that Ubuntu 18.04.2 is released, in a month or so, there’d be Linux Mint 19.2. Let’s see, if there is any new Cinnamon upgrades. If they happen, my Disco-Cinnamon would catch them.

#7

That was mentioned in my previous post, about Linux Mint being the cinnamon flavor, but at this point Linux Mint is in its own world now. Most likely, it won’t become a flavor.

#8

In the other post I stated why deepin is a challenge and risky for a desktop.

#9

We will see, if I need to I will follow the steps you did for Disco-Cinnamon to get Cinnamon 4.0. If I proceeded with a Cinnamon Remix I would try to get it released by around Ubuntu 19.10 or 20.04. If time does end up going on very fast, it would be released after 19.04 release.

#10

Naming it anything other than “Ubuntu Cinnamon Roll” would be a missed opportunity.

4 Likes
#11

Probably said before, but the name is not a priority, the priorities should be as follows:

  • Work with the Debian Cinnamon team to ensure Cinnamon is up-to-date in Debian Unstable, test it (fixes to upstream or Debian (if a Debian-specific bug)), and ensure that updates are passing through to Debian Testing (when Testing isn’t frozen)
  • Ensure that Cinnamon updates are synced from Debian Unstable to the Ubuntu development branch (when the development branch isn’t frozen), test them (fixes as feature freeze exceptions if during freeze, or fix in Ubuntu (if Ubuntu-specific), or Debian (if Debian-specific) or upstream (if neither))
  • Make SRUs for high-impact Cinnamon bugs and appropriate new Cinnamon microreleases for Cinnamon versions in supported Ubuntu releases
  • Create Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix ISOs (at least for the 19.04 development branch), test, and automate(?) the daily creation of the ISOs
  • Apply for official flavour status, including deciding on a name (probably Ubuntu Cinnamon, see below)

Though having said that the flavour name is low priority (though it should be ‘Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix’ for now):

This is sad (the old naming system was odd but a nice quirk of Ubuntu perhaps?), and means that the names of Ubuntu flavours are inconsistent, but I suppose *buntu names have already been approved and the Technical Board wouldn’t impose name changes on Kubuntu, Lubuntu, Xubuntu (Ubuntu KDE, Ubuntu LXQt, Ubuntu Xfce) for the sake of consistency? I wonder if the previous *buntu naming contributed to sites like DistroWatch considering flavours to be different to Ubuntu proper? Or maybe it’s because Ubuntu was the first GNU/Linux distro to do official flavours? I don’t know the history… Most GNU/Linux distro official respins (e.g. Mint MATE or Fedora Cinnamon) are considered to be the same as the default spin.

I’ve voted ‘Ubuntu Cinnamon’ trusting that what Popey says is correct, but wish the names were more consistent…

#12

Cinnamon is/was made only for one distro, Linux Mint, and Linux Mint is still based on Ubuntu and LMDE on Debian. Cinnamon DE would always work with both Ubuntu and Debian, and if it works with Ubuntu, then, it works with Debian unstable – Ubuntu is a tweaked mix of Debian Testing and Unstable, one of the reason, why Linux Mint stating that Ubuntu updates are not safe. That’s why Linux Mint had created a tweaked Synaptic, so not all Ubuntu updates get in and break it.

Linux Mint is quite successful in the Linux world, so would never think of being an Ubuntu flavour. Cinnamon was created, when Ubuntu started with Unity. And, the rest is known.

Just installed today’s Ubuntu 19.04 updates through Linux Mint’s Updater on my Disco-Cinnamon. The Updater is a part of that tweaked Synaptic. Installing apps or updating is through Gdebi or Synaptic, and not through a “software shop” that doesn’t tell you what it is installing. That’s one of the reasons, most Ubuntu users immediately install Synaptic.

Ubuntu Cinnamon Remix Update
#13

I will try to get a daily build out.

#14

Sorry for going off-topic, but I don’t think that’s true. It’s popular but not that popular. No official Ubuntu flavor installs it by default.

I disagree. There is https://spins.fedoraproject.org/cinnamon/

Also, I need to caution users about following your example: Mixing Ubuntu 19.04 repositories (which of course isn’t even released yet) with Linux Mint Tessa repositories creates a system that neither Ubuntu nor Linux Mint will be willing to support and it would probably need to be reinstalled to get back into a supportable status.

The best way forward for people who want a newer version of Cinnamon is to work to update the existing Cinnamon packages in Ubuntu (or support those who would do that work). There are many reasons why the Linux Mint packages are not acceptable as is in Debian or Ubuntu. Since Ubuntu’s Cinnamon packages come straight from Debian, it’s ultimately best to work with Debian on those packages but you could definitely start with a PPA if that’s easier.

4 Likes
#15

Hi, I co-founded Ubuntu GNOME years ago. (By the way, the last supported version of Ubuntu GNOME, 16.04, has only about 2 months of support left.)

In my opinion, the name was to some extent one of the least important details to creating and maintaining the project.

It is important though. In our case, since GNOME enforces their trademark, we had to get approval from both Canonical (the custodians of the Ubuntu trademark) and from the GNOME Foundation Board. I believe we (along with UbuntuKylin which was approved simultaneously) ended up being the first in the series of Ubuntu desktop flavors to use the current favored convention of Ubuntu DESKTOPNAME (although Ubuntu Server and Ubuntu Studio are relevant “prior art”.)

Because of name confusion, we couldn’t use Gubuntu. GNOME didn’t like the GNOMEbuntu proposal. Canonical Legal might have been relieved about that too.

Also, we had to develop a more independent logo since our first logo was too closely tied to GNOME.

It’s a bit early but I would encourage you to consider whether a completely unique name could work for your project instead of the obvious Ubuntu Cinnamon (Remix) name. It could let you avoid some trademark agreements and give your project a bit more freedom.

3 Likes
#16

Agreed, no official flavour installs Synaptic by default, because they are official flavours.

I remember the beginning, when Cinnamon was just starting. I installed every single one, and those before, when Mint was with Gnome 2.

Exactly!
Test until they break, or they don’t break. It is neither Mint nor Ubuntu, but it works, and if it stops, I’ll start again. Have enough 20GB partitions.

I also have an unusual Ubuntu that runs env GNOME_SHELL_SESSION_MODE=ubuntu /usr/bin/gnome-session --session=ubuntu. That too is holding on. Updating everyday to check, if any of my disco installs would break. Few days left for feature freeze, anyway.

For Debian or Ubuntu to have Mint packages in their repos, Mint devs have to make them first for themselves. And, those Mint packages would always be compatible, for the next Cinnamon-Mint LTS would have to be compatible with next Ubuntu LTS and next Debian.

Name can be decided on later, first the distro/remix has to be made. I am giving evidence that Cinnamon 4.0 works quite well with Disco, so @itzswirlz go ahead and make the Cinnamon Remix.

#17

Whether or not flavors are official doesn’t mean that dictates if we can install Synaptic. It’s in Universe, so only the flavors could install it by default, but it could happen.

#18

I never really used Synaptic, but yes, Synaptic would be a good cause for this case.

And Cinnamon was not made for other distros, I don’t think the LM team made it for it’s own distro. It was most likely made for people who hated GNOME Shell when it was introduced in 2011.

And, I don’t think I would suggest this if Fedora didn’t have a spin-I actually used to have the Cinnamon Spin installed.

Synaptic can be trickier, but we always have to be careful, so hopefully I’ll be able to reach out to the Linux Mint team and talk with them.

#19

Hi, nice to meet you!

I am very aware about this-naming is kind of also scary because the last thing we want is for Canonical to get upset at us. We also, as I mentioned will need to make a communication with Linux Mint in order to get Cinnamon 4.0.

For a name, then again, also a question for linux mint. I also thought Cubuntu would be bad due to the name confusion.

And for a logo, I was kind of thinking of having a logo of the icon-and around it would be a circle, that when a “button” would illuminate/unilluminate, there would be no button, just a shaker pouring cinnamon to fill the outer circle, and as it goes, the text “Ubuntu Cinnamon” would partially go on, like in the Fedora plymouth boot screen.

#20

It seems like Synaptic is the word, and due to the Cinnamon 4.0 - Ubuntu bridge, through Linux Mint, then Synaptic is most likely required due to @chanath’s Disco-Cinnamon.

Also, I’ve been looking at other flavors. Some of them, I think Xubuntu, came with Synaptic. People like Synaptic, so we should just take a chance and include it.